tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29767791.post3473035799286249744..comments2023-07-09T08:47:39.465-04:00Comments on Man From Atlan: Whither Christianity?Man From Atlanhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08564058987138711708noreply@blogger.comBlogger28125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29767791.post-7152062537797375332009-05-15T16:56:00.000-04:002009-05-15T16:56:00.000-04:00Thanks to you too, moonkoon.Thanks to you too, moonkoon.Man From Atlanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08564058987138711708noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29767791.post-76472517476501718512009-05-14T09:46:00.000-04:002009-05-14T09:46:00.000-04:00Hi Moonkoon, I really miss hearing from you. So ni...Hi Moonkoon, I really miss hearing from you. So nice to hear from you again. I always thought your ideas highly original and your voice distinctive. Your were also remarkably tolerant toward my own excesses. (I'm a reformed character now, you'll be pleased to hear!)Xanadunoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29767791.post-84448135980986640222009-05-10T08:40:00.000-04:002009-05-10T08:40:00.000-04:00Hello and best wishes to hp and Xanadu.
"The fact...Hello and best wishes to hp and Xanadu.<br /><br /><I>"The fact remains that the hundreds of thousands of pages written in the Vedas, and the Buddhist and Muslim teachings, can't match the simplicity of the story of Jesus."</I>I think you are right about power of simplicity, MFA.<br /><br />Christianity, (in a roundabout and multi threaded sort of way, via Sumer, Egypt and Persia), owes much of its canon to the Eastern tradition.<br /><br />An understanding of the common threads that connect mankind helps me to accept and tolerate the "love one another as my Father loves you" message that Jesus brings. Love is our strength, we are burden enough to the world with it and without it we are a menace, "better that we were never born", as Jesus might say. In a way, it is our saving grace as it seems that others have it over us in most other skills and attributes ("What about intellect?", you might exclaim, <br />to which I would reply, "Let me know when, bird to man, you outsmart a crow." :-))<br /><br />I think that Jesus embodies the great revelation that, despite many failings in its observation, has made life the generally fulfilling experience that it is today. That fulfillment also includes the realisation of our short-comings while in this "vale of tears".<br /><br />Many bad deeds are done in Christianity's name but they are not done in it's spirit, which is Agape.<br /><br />Thanks once again for your great blog, MFA.moonkoonnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29767791.post-39139533776256314622009-04-27T06:53:00.000-04:002009-04-27T06:53:00.000-04:00I might be the wrong person to ask on the subject ...I might be the wrong person to ask on the subject of meat; I recall a life where as a Huron medicine man I ate the heart of an enemy as part of a spiritual process, and my wife and I ate placenta after the birth of our child. Cooked of course, but still, to help the recovery after pregnancy but also a spiritual process.<br />I'm sure there were saints who didn't eat for years and yogis who float ;) but as a goal in itself, it's all a show of piety and a form of religious mania.<br />And heaven is a state of oneness and also nothingness, and we all experience that at one time or the other.Man From Atlanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08564058987138711708noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29767791.post-80821091645215138242009-04-26T12:07:00.000-04:002009-04-26T12:07:00.000-04:00St Catherine of Siena lived on the Holy Eucharist ...St Catherine of Siena lived on the Holy Eucharist alone for months at a time; she would actually get ill when forced to eat food. <br /><br />Other saintly women who went without food for years were Angela of Foligno, Catherine of Genoa, Elizabeth the Good, Gemma Galgani and St Rose of Lima. I mention these five only. There were dozens of others. <br /><br />Frauds and the charlatans might well outnumber genuine mystics by a factor of 1000 to 1, but I do believe that genuine instances of the "miraculous" exist. I have encountered them myself.Xanadunoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29767791.post-5944617280867986412009-04-26T11:37:00.000-04:002009-04-26T11:37:00.000-04:00Cheer up, Homer, I'm sure there are no carnivores ...Cheer up, Homer, I'm sure there are no carnivores in heaven! The more sensitive one is, the more I think one tends to be a vegetarian. (No offence to MFA). <br /><br />Bernard Shaw was a strict vegan and lived to a ripe old age. In Yogananda's 'Autobiography' there is a photograph of a vegetarian lion, kept as a pet by some yogi. Certain Catholic saints reportedly gave up food altogether and subsisted entirely on the Holy Eucharist once a day — a thin coin-sized wafer of bread as light as a feather.Xanadunoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29767791.post-83071748000633250942009-04-25T23:45:00.000-04:002009-04-25T23:45:00.000-04:00I tend to agree with Thoreau..
"One farmer says ...I tend to agree with Thoreau.. <br /><br />"One farmer says to me, "You cannot live on vegetable food solely, for it furnishes nothing to make the bones with;" and so he religiously devotes a part of his day to supplying himself with the raw material of bones; walking all the while he talks behind his oxen, which, with vegetable-made bones, jerk him and his lumbering plow along in spite of every obstacle." ~Henry David Thoreau<br /><br />As for the slaughtering, for quite some time now I've said the truth, (the seminary students used to get upset), the firing squad is good enough for me...<br />Thanks, <br />hpAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29767791.post-30201600342354049402009-04-25T14:45:00.000-04:002009-04-25T14:45:00.000-04:00You'll be pleased to know we only eat organic, hum...You'll be pleased to know we only eat organic, humanely slaughtered meat. But that's our choice. If a person makes a spiritually oriented choice, that is up to them to make. But from a health point of view, occasional meat is necessary for most people, and especially for children. All foods are provided by God for a reason.<br />So Ahimsa, and grace, may come from respect for all beings, but first look after YOUR needs, and your family. <br />And it strikes me that even the spiritual argument is flawed, but I won't argue that this weekend :)Man From Atlanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08564058987138711708noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29767791.post-82289413501272355802009-04-23T17:52:00.000-04:002009-04-23T17:52:00.000-04:00There is an amusing anecdote about Bernard Shaw an...There is an amusing anecdote about Bernard Shaw and the extent to which this sensitive vegetarian practised <I>ahimsa.</I> <br /><br />A female visitor to his house, noticing that the garden was full of flowers but that none were to be seen anywhere in the house, said to him:<br /><br />"Mr Shaw, I can't help noticing the complete absence of flowers in your house. Don't you <I>like</I> flowers?"<br /><br />"I adore them, madam," Shaw replied. "I also adore childen, but I don't cut off their heads and put them in vases!"Xanadunoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29767791.post-44423558159557784132009-04-23T17:50:00.000-04:002009-04-23T17:50:00.000-04:00Hmmm, you both make some excellent points and are ...Hmmm, you both make some excellent points and are probably right to think as you do. Experience has taught me not to be too dogmatic about anything, for I have often been proved wrong in the past. Truth can only be reached through a thicket of opinions.<br /><br />I'm sure you would agree, MFA — as Homer probably would — that true <I>ahimsa</I> is incompatible with the grim rituals of the slaughterhouse. <br /><br />Though there is nothing in religion that FORBIDS meateating, vegetarianism is surely the kinder alternative. Wouldn't you think so if you were an animal?Xanadunoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29767791.post-48559888441508696102009-04-23T16:22:00.000-04:002009-04-23T16:22:00.000-04:00I agree with Tolstoy 100%.
Some things you just kn...I agree with Tolstoy 100%.<br />Some things you just know..<br /><br />And regardless of whatever means one uses to justify/explain whatever, the ultimate truth lies in your own heart. <br /><br />Your decision made me very happy for YOU, Xanadu.<br />Because I feel, no, because I KNOW how you feel.<br />And so does Paramatma.<br />hp<br /><br />http://krishna.org/images/Misc/creation.jpg<br /><br /> Srila Prabhupada: If you simply want an ordinary education, you have to devote so much time, labor, and understanding to it. Similarly, if you are going to take to spiritual life, you must become serious. How is it that simply by some wonderful mantras, someone can become God in six months? Why do people want something like that? This means that they want to be cheated.<br /><br />Reporter: How can a person tell he has a genuine guru?<br /><br />Srila Prabhupada: Can any of my students answer this question?<br /><br />Disciple: Once I remember John Lennon asked you, “How will I know who is the genuine guru?” And you answered, “Just find out the one who is most addicted to Krsna. He is genuine.”Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29767791.post-64363004479651354632009-04-23T12:16:00.000-04:002009-04-23T12:16:00.000-04:00Was Jesus a Vegetarian?
http://www.lavistachurchof...Was Jesus a Vegetarian?<br />http://www.lavistachurchofchrist.org/LVarticles/DidJesusEatMeat.htm <br />""... observe the Passover to the LORD. 'In the second month on the fourteenth day at twilight, they shall observe it; they shall eat it with unleavened bread and bitter herbs. 'They shall leave none of it until morning, nor break a bone of it; according to all the statute of the Passover they shall observe it. 'But the man who is clean and is not on a journey, and yet neglects to observe the Passover, that person shall then be cut off from his people, for he did not present the offering of the LORD at its appointed time. That man will bear his sin." (Numbers 9:10-13)"<br />""Then came the first day of Unleavened Bread on which the Passover lamb had to be sacrificed. And Jesus sent Peter and John, saying, "Go and prepare the Passover for us, so that we may eat it."" (Luke 22:7-8)"<br />http://www.kamat.com/kalranga/mythology/krishna/picnic.htm <br />Lord Krsinha goes on a picnic :)Man From Atlanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08564058987138711708noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29767791.post-683492055429460812009-04-23T12:00:00.000-04:002009-04-23T12:00:00.000-04:00Come on, Xanadu. I'm not trying to convert anyone ...Come on, Xanadu. I'm not trying to convert anyone to meatarianism :)<br />but there is NO evidence Jesus was an Essene. His cousin John the Baptist was, and they split with each other. The Essenes were non-traditional Jews, and he made it clear he followed the law of Moses, but in his own idiosyncratic manner. How would he have celebrated Passover without eating the Passover Lamb? How many references to cattle are there in the Bible, and how about the injunction in the Torah that all foods were given by God for the benefit of Man? (Except for the listed no nos, which did not include Beef)<br />Is it ok for a Christian to be a vegetarian? If they like. But they shouldn't use scripture to justify a personal choice without at least point to the verse prohibiting it.<br />Was Krishna a vegetarian? Perhaps, but Rama certainly was not, nor was Sakyamuni. http://www.hindunet.org/srh_home/1997_5/0117.htmlMan From Atlanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08564058987138711708noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29767791.post-39860575118738709792009-04-23T07:12:00.000-04:002009-04-23T07:12:00.000-04:00Btw, don't be misled by the word "meat" when you s...Btw, don't be misled by the word "meat" when you see it in the King James version of the New Testament. <br /><br />"Meat" in 15-17C English did not mean meat in our sense, but was simply a synonym for "food" or a "meal". ("We sat down to meat" = "We sat down for a meal.") <br /><br />Oxford Dictionary (1): MEAT = Food in general; usually, solid food, in contradistinction to <I>drink</I>. Also, anything eaten or imbibed, e.g., "Thy mete shall be mylk, honey and wyne." (Middle English).<br /><br />In the bit you quote from Acts 2:46, "Eat their MEAT with gladness," meat simply meant "food." In fact, St Jerome's Latin, from which the English was translated, uses the word CIBUS (Latin for "food").<br /><br />Sorry for being such a pedantic bore. Must resist this temptation in future!<br /><br />My conclusion? Christ was a strict vegetarian (a vegan) at most times, but occasionally ate fish out of deference to his disciples who were fishermen. The fish were already dead, so what harm eating them if it pleased his disciples? <br /><br />(I know vegetarians who follow a similar practice: vegetarians at home, but happy to accept whatever is put in front of them when they are guests in someone else's house — so as not to give offence.)Xanadunoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29767791.post-36597747313515823222009-04-23T06:52:00.000-04:002009-04-23T06:52:00.000-04:00MFA, You are right about Christ being PERMITTED to...MFA, You are right about Christ being PERMITTED to eat meat by the Mosaic law, but you are perhaps a bit hasty in assuming that people will automatically do what they are permitted to do. Millions of people throughout history have lived strictly celibate lives, though they could easily have opted for sex if they had so wished.<br /><br />Note this: <br /><br /><B>"The Essenes were one of the three main religious sects in first century Palestine and Jesus is believed to have been a member of the northern group...Members of the sect wore white and followed a vegetarian diet...current members of that order claim that Jesus was an Essene and [he is] portrayed as A STRICT VEGETARIAN</B> [My capitals]<br /><br />http://www.ivu.org/news/1-96/essenes.html<br /><br />True ahimsa would surely require a vegan diet...and yet, if the Gospels are correct, it would seem that Christ ate fish. (Luke 24: 41-43).Xanadunoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29767791.post-6989090535949689932009-04-20T16:32:00.000-04:002009-04-20T16:32:00.000-04:00A big smile to you, Xanadu!
I hear chirps and pee...A big smile to you, Xanadu!<br /><br />I hear chirps and peeps and baas and moos and whistles and grunts and clicks and clacks of thanks.<br />hpAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29767791.post-13417394355571942062009-04-20T12:44:00.000-04:002009-04-20T12:44:00.000-04:00Did Jesus eat meat? Yes, all things (with exceptio...Did Jesus eat meat? Yes, all things (with exceptions) being permissible according to the law.<br />http://www.lavistachurchofchrist.org/LVarticles/DidJesusEatMeat.htm<br />And his apostles did too, The Acts 2:46 "eat their meat with gladness"<br />Perhaps if we did too?Man From Atlanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08564058987138711708noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29767791.post-39415506238132662982009-04-20T07:29:00.000-04:002009-04-20T07:29:00.000-04:00Homer, your quotes advocating vegetarianism have b...Homer, your quotes advocating vegetarianism have been a catalyst to my decision to give up meat. <br /><br />I will stick with fish for the time being, however, for the following three reasons: <br /><br />(1) Fish is a valuable source of Vitamin D and essential fatty acids; it is also good for the brain — hence the high IQ of fish-eating nations like the Japanese. <br /><br />(2) Christ ate fish, and his apostles were all fishermen; so if fish eating was good enough for Christ, it has to be good enough for me. <br /><br />(3) According to the Essenes and a passage in the <I>Gospel of St Thomas</I>, lower forms of life benefit spiritually by being eaten by higher forms of life. Their essence is allegedly transformed; and the next time they are reborn, they will be reborn as human beings — or so it is said. <br /><br />According to this viewpoint, it follows logically that human beings would benefit if they became food for spiritually advanced extraterrestrials. An intriguing if somewhat disquieting thought!<br /><br />Incidentally, Ouspensky thought human beings were "food for the moon". (See <I>In Search of the Miraculous</I> and <I>The Fourth Way.)</I>Xanadunoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29767791.post-49933706404674511152009-04-20T07:24:00.000-04:002009-04-20T07:24:00.000-04:00Homer, thanks for the quote from Srimad Bhagavatam...Homer, thanks for the quote from <I>Srimad Bhagavatam</I>. This is like old times on Xymphora! <br /><br />MFA, I wish you would write an article one day on the Islamic paradise, comparing it with the Christian and Hindu heavens. <br /><br />The idea of the 72 virgins intrigues me in particular, especially as this aspect of Islam has been used by Islamophobes as a big stick to beat Islam with. (For example, the silly idea that suicide bombers are motivated by little more than the desire for promiscuous sex in heaven!)Xanadunoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29767791.post-5043868791388610252009-04-18T10:00:00.000-04:002009-04-18T10:00:00.000-04:00You're welcome, homer. This is a place where peopl...You're welcome, homer. This is a place where people can tak to each other.Man From Atlanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08564058987138711708noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29767791.post-15540089160102355992009-04-18T00:35:00.000-04:002009-04-18T00:35:00.000-04:00No Xanadu, I don't read much Mencken. Though I sti...No Xanadu, I don't read much Mencken. Though I still do enjoy a quip or two of his at times. <br />My bike I gave to my friend in Austin, when I left Texas last November. <br />Anyways, glad you are well. Here's a little something you may enjoy..<br />Thanks for the little visit.<br />Homer <br /><br />"When the rivers hear the flute-song of Kṛṣṇa, their minds begin to desire Him, and thus the flow of their currents is broken and their waters are agitated, moving around in whirlpools. Then with the arms of their waves the rivers embrace Murāri's lotus feet and, holding on to them, present offerings of lotus flowers."<br />Srimad Bhagavatam<br /><br />Thanks Naseer, for the medium!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29767791.post-72620987125758841702009-04-17T20:11:00.000-04:002009-04-17T20:11:00.000-04:00Dear Homer, I gained more from you than you gained...Dear Homer, I gained more from you than you gained from me, and that is the truth. Are you still riding that bike and reading Mencken?<br /><br />Vedanta is the bond between us. You understood me, and I understood you. Though I practise Catholicism, I love the Sacred Books of the East like you do, because I was born in India and that country has entered into my bloodstream.<br /><br />I still have the links you sent me. Thank you.Xanadunoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29767791.post-50805061681934150652009-04-17T19:34:00.000-04:002009-04-17T19:34:00.000-04:00P.S. Hi Xanadu! Hope you are healthy and hale!
Y...P.S. Hi Xanadu! Hope you are healthy and hale! <br />You are a very nice person. I always enjoyed your words and emotions. <br />hpAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29767791.post-82109934628721381492009-04-17T19:12:00.000-04:002009-04-17T19:12:00.000-04:00I find it hard, impossible to understand what it i...I find it hard, impossible to understand what it is about "thou shall not kill" that they, these fine kind and caring people, all of them, from Christians to Muslims, Jews to Hindus, do not understand.<br />A ten minute or two hour long epiphany is not very impressive. <br />To me, talking high philosophy or religion over chicken salad is an absurdity. <br />Neither is ignorance of karma an excuse..<br /><br />"Thou shalt not kill" does not apply to murder of one's own kind only, but to all living beings; and this Commandment was inscribed in the human breast long before it was proclaimed from Sinai. ~Leo Tolstoy<br /><br />I do not like eating meat because I have seen lambs and pigs killed. I saw and felt their pain. They felt the approaching death. I could not bear it. I cried like a child. I ran up a hill and could not breathe. I felt that I was choking. I felt the death of the lamb. ~Vaslav Nijinsky<br /><br />You have just dined, and however scrupulously the slaughterhouse is concealed in the graceful distance of miles, there is complicity. ~Ralph Waldo Emerson<br /><br />While we ourselves are the living graves of murdered beasts, how can we expect any ideal conditions on this earth? ~George Bernard Shaw<br /><br />To my mind, the life of a lamb is no less precious than that of a human being. I should be unwilling to take the life of a lamb for the sake of the human body. ~Mahatma Gandhi<br /><br />Thank you,<br />hpAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29767791.post-50813672138109022322009-04-14T09:11:00.000-04:002009-04-14T09:11:00.000-04:00Dante just wrote the earlier version of the Muhamm...Dante just wrote the earlier version of the Muhammad cartoons, LOL. Then, it was the Christian kingdoms versus the Ottoman Empire, and now, the globalists versus those who don't want a homogenised religion. I admire that attempt to be pure, actually, even if I disagree. But nothing justifies war, and I dislike the lies told to justify it.Man From Atlanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08564058987138711708noreply@blogger.com